eBay, Clear as Mud

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October 26, 2009

eBay, Clear as Mud

By: Ina Steiner

Mon Oct 26 2009 15:10:11

To the Editor:
This subject may have been beat to death, but it still shows that there is just no simply understanding.

Link to eBay discussion board - "1 & 2's are now treated differently than 3,4,5's DSR's"

Interesting to follow,
Johnny

Comments (18) | Leave Comment | Permalink

Readers Comments

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: Kevin

Mon Oct 26 18:41:01 2009

clear as mud is about right.....it would be better if they went back to the simpler way of things. No "algorithms", get rid of best match and all of the other things that in theory seem like a good idea but in practice are disasters. I still can't believe not one of their braintrusts didn't catch A. bove S. tandard S. eller before going live with it! Gotta laugh at that one!

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: jerry

Mon Oct 26 20:00:40 2009

As sad as it is....just because Griff and some CS reps said that's the case, I wouldn't take it as gospel.

I do know they are updating the SNP policy and the 5% thing is no longer in effect, at least in the US. It is all DSR based now....I assume the maximum percentage of 1's and 2's being the new standard.

I think sellers should be worried about April if Ebay indeed reduces max percentage of 1's and 2's to 1 percent for item as described and 2% for everything else. ALOT of people are going to be gone there......

Think of the 5% requirement being tightened to 1-2%. That is pretty much an impossible bar for most sellers. They need to keep the percentages where they are at now.....3% for item description and 4% for the rest.

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: JG

Mon Oct 26 23:53:29 2009

You know, this link just makes the entire process seem ludicrous - like arguing how many angels can dance on the head of a pin? If only the buyers knew what feedback was all about and how one star could mean a huge difference to an ebay seller's profits. Has ebay done anything to educate the buying public on the huge responsibility each buyer has? I don't think most buyers do know and they just fill it out, not knowing a 4 means so much less than a 5. I'd have to look up what the 3. 4 and 5 stand for, but without looking I'd say a 3 was good, average transaction, 4 is a very good transaction, and a 5 is an excellent transaction. This is just COMMON SENSE to a buyer, yet we have these convoluted arguments about it applying to all feedback, to all sales, etc., etc. Is there somehow to make this process simpler? My main beef with feedback as a seller is that the feedback gives the same power to a preteen kid purchasing a $1.99 item as it gives to the person who has just purchased 6 place settings of expensive china. What gives with that? In what universe of sales is that deal acceptable? Negative feedback can be left in ignorance, in anger, or in a very casual way. It has been given too much importance to a seller's ratings. Somewhere they call this being ''hog-tied.'' Thanks for listening to my venting.

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: Mud

Tue Oct 27 08:25:10 2009

What about the serial feedback killers?

I got hit last week by one. Emailed and asked why she/he had left me a 1 in communication since I responded to her/his many questions quickly. They said it was because I hadn't left them feedback first!

I wrote back and told them I do leave feedback for buyers even if they don't leave it for me, but I only do it about once a week. They just beat me too it.

I personally don't believe that just because a buyer leaves me feedback before I get a chance to leave it for them constitutes me as a bad seller.

I can also tell that they leave A LOT of 1's. MORE THEN HALF OF ALL FEEDBACK GIVEN OUT! They write "THANKS" positive feedback then 1. EBAY must love these people, taking away the incentive from a ton of sellers.

In my buying experience I don't think I have ever left a 1. I also don't think buyers should be able to rate more the half of there transaction a 1. If a buyer actually thought that there buying experiences on a site was that poor they wouldn't shop there. They are doing it for other reasons.

This has such negative impact to a seller. It is NOT an incentive to do better, because it just doesn't matter how you preform as a seller. There are those that eBay allows to abuse the system.

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: Bob

Tue Oct 27 09:28:48 2009

You better be careful Clear as Mud. You are violationg eBay rules for contacting a Buyer about Feedback. You are not allowed to do that. You are just looking to complicate your own problems. Just some friendly advice.

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: Mud

Tue Oct 27 10:27:57 2009

Thanks for the advice, I wasn't aware that it was against policy. I wasn't rude just looking for information. If someone does leave a 1 or 2 they should at the very least be required to provide a brief statement about why. Seller should have access to this.

So basically the feedback system serves no purpose if you can't contact buyer who were disappointed with their shopping experience and ask what you could have done better.

I never would have dreamed that it would be so upsetting to buyer that feedback wasn't left for them immediately unless I had contacted them to see how I could improve.

Trust me they have left a lot of these for other seller too. If you got a "thanks" you might have got a 1.

Just trying to help other sellers avoid the serial feedback killer.

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: Jim

Tue Oct 27 11:18:58 2009

At a minimum, a one must be accompanied by a eBay claim and resolution.

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: Rick

Tue Oct 27 11:38:14 2009

I never understood why sellers don't leave feedback right after the buyer pays. There is no reason for holding it back, since it is against policy to leave a negative comment in a positive rating. The feedback system is useless as far as rating a buyer. Save yourself the headaches and just leave feedback for your customers. They'll appreciate it and you'll stay out of hot water.

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: Frank

Tue Oct 27 12:01:20 2009

Yes, Rick and you probably think its OK to leave a 1 for a seller who schedules the process of leaving feedback to twice or so a week.

I also don't leave feedback immediately, I always check tracking and make sure the package is delivered. Then I leave feedback. Ebay has no built in system to track and mark this so I track and mark by leaving feedback. If I see a package hasn't been delivered in a certain time frame I contact the buyer. I would rather help the buyer locate the package and avoid the buyer having a bad experience.

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: Rick

Tue Oct 27 12:14:49 2009

You've just defined great customer service.

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: Rick

Tue Oct 27 12:18:07 2009

I guess my next question would be. Why hold feedback for a buyer after they pay? Why do you wait till they leave feedback first?

I am a seller by the way. This is about whether I agree with Ebays policies are not. That is a completely different story. This is purely about leaving feedback for your customers and why you wait, when you can always add follow-up comments later.

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: JG

Tue Oct 27 12:54:43 2009

I don't think most buyers care about leaving feedback -- so those 1's were definitely a tactic. Shouldn't there be a way to have eBay as a normal practice take your feedback and match it against the buyer's record? Maybe buyers should have DBRs that are Buyers Ratings and lower the impact of the feedback they give sellers. What a fine mess we've gotten ourselves into!

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: Mud

Tue Oct 27 12:55:04 2009

@Rick
Is your question to me or the seller community as a whole?

I made it quite clear that I don't hold feedback for a buyer until they leave feedback for me first. I just don't have it automated so its impossible to leave feedback as soon as a buyer pays.

Plus leaving feedback, in my opinion, is timely as is everything on eBay's website- Relisting, Revising, Creating add and etc. So I do it in bunches like Relisting, revising, creating adds and etc.

So let me ask you Rick-Do you ship every package as soon as a buyer purchases an item? I do. So I might not leave feedback everyday a ship everyday. I guess its about prioritizing what is important. I have my priorities straight.

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: just a thought

Tue Oct 27 14:04:56 2009

I haven't left feedback for buyers in over a year. I refuse to patronize Ebay and their stupid rules. FEEDBACK IS NOT REQUIRED

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: Deb

Tue Oct 27 16:58:26 2009

Feedback? When it means as much to a buyer and counts for something within ebay, I'll once again leave it for my buyer. How about not allowing a buyer to bid until prior transactions which have been paid for and delivered are left feedback? Make it really mean something for a buyer.

I thank them numerous times throughout. Email when the package ships with the tracking, thanking them one final time, I hear absolutely NOTHING from them, just a paypal payment and if I'm fortunate enough I get feedback and a rating.
Is their (ebay's and the buyers) arrogance & ego so unstable that feedback has now become a tool / reason to crapcan a seller, use it against them just because the seller didn't leave it first or fast enough?

I don't participate in a ritual as one sided as ebay's feedback. It's optional. When ebay makes it mandatory for each buyer of every transaction to leave feedback, since a sellers business survival / existence depends on it, I will think about participating once again.

How can it be allowed that I am judged on 10 out of 50 transactions when not every buyer chooses to leave feedback or a rating? How can ebay see that as being fair? The odds of 1, 1 & 2 in ten is a hellofallot worse than 1, 1 & 2 out of 50! Where's the logic? If ebay wants to praise or condemn a seller through buyers opinions, then by gosh they better count all of my auction transactions and not some.

I have no control over my buyers to make them do anything. I can inform & educate them if ebay would let me contact easier to communicate, if the buyer reads and chooses to learn and wants to know.
I am not their brain, hands, typing finger, body, not in their home twisting their arms behind their backs making them type a feedback.

I no longer have control of my business once I choose to sell on ebay. Are they a venue? Am I working for ebay? Those are the questions that need serious looking into.

My only option is to be a part of ebay's work force or not be. Either by my choice while being a good girl or in some cases ebay kicking you off, not wanting you, for being a bad girl or not giving ebay enough, too little seller performance.

What scraps are left after everyone is fed, I get. Those scraps are becoming less and the work is more. Something doesn't feel right any more.

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: Jim

Wed Oct 28 14:08:33 2009

My experience at the moment is that numerous emails are not useful. It may make as many people mad with extra emails(I am in that category) as happy with the extra attention. However with SPAM and clogged mail boxes as it is, I doubt that lots of touche feely emails are worth the effort.

At the moment a %20 discount comes to about $10 a week for me. While mileage will vary it is a business decision to freak out over the discount.

An estimate of $10,000 month operation would be about $2,000 in final value fees at most. A 20% discount is $400 or $100 a week or %4 of sales. Given that getting the beloved discount is iffy, how much effort and time to put in to it is iffy. Boost sales or profits might yield more than trying to make the requirements for getting a Top Rated Seller badge.

As I have mentioned before, the TRS allows the badge holder to charge more which will mean fewer buyers will use the TRS only search and go with the lowest price search. My reaction would be to charge a bit less than the TRS folks.

It will take a real statistical effort to see if the TRS badge is worth anything by comparing sales of similar sellers with and without. Or the sales of the same seller with and without a TRS badge.

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: charles

Wed Oct 28 22:27:59 2009

The new ebay policy, I think is near impossible to reach if your full time, and selling pre owned stuff. I know its forcing me off the site. i have doubled my Amazon sells in the last 60 days, and my other site on Tias has increased also, This is all business that ebay has lost, and I am sure I am not the only loyal seller being forced out.

eBay, Clear as Mud

by: mud

Thu Oct 29 14:24:11 2009

@Jim
Very insightful.

I think I was getting pulled into the TRS seller hype, but really for me the amount saved is so tiny and most sellers shop eBay for deals. So who cares about TRS.

I have TRS badge now but no sales. It doesn't help sales.

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